What’s your hidden agenda? - Matt Smith

TUCP Intro/Outro: 00:00:08

Welcome to The Ultimate Coach Podcast conversations from being inspired by the book, The Ultimate coach written by Amy Hardison, and Alan Thompson. Join us each week with the intention of expanding your state of being. And your experience will be remarkable. Remember, this is a podcast about be, it is a podcast about you. To explore more deeply visit theultimateCoachbook.com. Now, enjoy today's conversation from being

Philippe Bartu: 00:00:48

welcome back for another episode of The Ultimate Coach Podcast. My name is Philip Bartu, and I'm really excited to try a new format this week. So far with this podcast, it has been every week, I've been really just having a real free flow in conversations and just seeing what comes up. And today we're gonna try a little different format. I'm being joined today by the wonderful Matt Smith. Matt is is a coach, but also the the visionary behind the London experience. And in a conversation I had with Matt, recently, what we discovered was talking around hidden agendas. And so we're creating a bit of a container in how and what we're going to explore together today. And we invite you to really explore alongside of us. And we're going to be uncovering hidden agendas, why we have them what they are, how to overcome them. And get hopefully we can both explore that for ourselves and each other and become more free in how we show up in the world. So Matt, hey, thank you, Matt, for being here with me today. It's my pleasure, Phillip, thank you for having me. And looking forward to it. Yeah, well, I, you know, we just spoke a couple of days ago, and there's something that you shared with me. Well, why don't we open with that? Maybe you can tell us a little bit about some of the realizations that you've had from being the vision behind the London experience and how that unfolded. And some of the realizations you've had about your own hidden agendas around that.

Matt Smith: 00:02:33

Yeah, of course, it's sort of my mind is jumping around with so many places to start and where to go with it. But essentially, I remember doing the meditation on December 27, and being given the vision for the ultimate experience in London. And and it was, it was a phenomenal experience. Like, as you are aware, and I think people have seen that we created when I say we like me, and the whole team, everyone involved including yourself created a the ultimate experience in London with 500 people there and an incredible speakers. Steve, Amy peran Alan, it was just, and Casey doing his thing as well. And, and it was just a phenomenal experience. But But since then, I've been in this bit of a just a weird space where like motivation was low and almost like an apathetic kind of energy. You know, I reached the mountaintop the pinnacle, because it was a vision that I had for four or five years, like me on stage and a big group of people. I was like, yeah, that's, that's the goal. That's the vision and then and then it was like this space of like nothingness afterwards, it was weird because still having to like show up in life like for my coaching business and my clients which was fine. Like, that's what I love to do and really enjoyed that. But then day to day was just a bit of a her this expression called like a leaf in the wind, I would have been blown around different places and so many things have happened since then. And then um, and the biggest thing was the relationship with with my girlfriend Jess and we were spending more time together and being with each other and things were showed up for us and and there was this conflict because I believe that we're all worthy and deserving of everything that we want to have an experience and be and do and I don't believe we have to prove ourselves or anything. But talking on the hidden agenda thing is what I didn't realize is a lot of what I did in the world was from a place of needing external validation, approval, acceptance and love and, and there's no bigger Hi, I guess when you're seeking that then being on stage and having 500 incredible people singing Happy Birthday to you later. Like, yeah, there ever was a tick the box for external validation and approval and love. That's kind of it right? Yeah. But I remember I don't know if you ever saw her like the Tyson fury story and his interviews and things about how when he became world champion, he went off into like this depression thing and all the drugs and all of that when I didn't go into the light. Yeah, it happens a lot. Yeah, it's, and so had to do a lot of soul searching and, and things since then to realize, and it was only recently that I realized that that's what it was this this this need for external validation and love and approval. And then. So yeah, that's kind of the journey up until recently in looking, we can probably share a bit more,

Philippe Bartu: 00:05:45

as we well, you know, I want to firstly just acknowledge you for your openness. You know, one of the things I love about you, Matt, is you're just, firstly, you're so authentic and vulnerable, and just willing to show up and share things as they are. And I really appreciate about that, I appreciate that about you, what I also appreciate is, you're always, you're someone who's going to do whatever it takes to do the work and get complete with whatever it is you need to be complete with. And, and to keep you know, you have such a commitment to your own growth, that just listening to you speak, and I can just see that. And I just want to acknowledge you for that and find that super inspiring. So thank you for sharing that. And, you know, from what I'm hearing, it's wanting to feel loved and accepted. And you know, isn't isn't if you think about it isn't that like what our whole child like, from when were born as a baby to growing up, like every child just wants to feel loved and accepted. And so this whole seeking external validation, gosh, I can so, so, so relate to that. And it's, I don't think it's something that you get that you kind of have figured out and, and you know, you can, you know, you've seen it, and you're and you're now free, and you can keep you know, and you're and you're, you're enlightened, right and that's it, you've understood that nothing outside of you can bring validation, and you are now free to show up and be powerful. My, my experience of this and the way that you share it with it is it's like comes with levels of awareness. So wanting to feel loved and accepted is can be a place to come from when you're creating something. And and in, in what I'm hearing and you're sharing is would you say that the whole experience, the hidden agenda, and the place that you may not have been aware of, but there was a part of you that was doing it because you wanted to feel loved and accepted. 100% might say Wow, 100%

Matt Smith: 00:07:57

like No, no, like, it was 100% of me. That was the only reason I did it. But um, yeah, certain that there was a that was where it was coming from. I mean,

Philippe Bartu: 00:08:06

so So yes. So if we just if we just look at that, if you say you're 100% certain what, what is what is actually the payoff of actually being loved and acceptance for Yeah, what was the payoff?

Matt Smith: 00:08:23

The payoff to getting loved and accepted was feeling safe.

Philippe Bartu: 00:08:28

Right. So kind of safety and security. Yeah, yeah.

Matt Smith: 00:08:33

Because, again, having studied Yeah, human behavior, why we do what we do that I knew that's where it was coming from. It's the if I don't get love and acceptance and validation, then there's that fear of being abandoned. And then yeah,

Philippe Bartu: 00:08:45

yeah, so avoid avoid abandonment. Yeah. Feeling safe. Yeah. Yeah. And, and, you know, what's also interesting is when when we look at these sort of this is a way of being you know, and being someone who is seeking love and acceptance, when you are being that what's the cost?

Matt Smith: 00:09:06

Be authenticity, because centricity.

Philippe Bartu: 00:09:08

Yeah, 100%

Matt Smith: 00:09:09

Because if my safety is outside of me, I'm going to try and do things to get that from other people which which can be manipulative at times. Yeah.

Philippe Bartu: 00:09:19

And so the so the doing looks like one

Matt Smith: 00:09:23

trying to be trying to be perfect that doing looks like look perfect. Perfect. Be perfect.

Philippe Bartu: 00:09:32

That's tiring. Oh, gosh, yeah, I was I was a professional looking good, or perfect. Or I had a whole profession where I was a professional people pleaser. So we can speak a bit more about that later. But you're really this this really resonates with me on so many, so many levels. So let's just keep looking here. Because I think there's this there's more to uncover around. What are What are the costs are you paying for in coming from a place of being loved and accepted? Yama is looking at us. Yeah. Like what are the other costs? You may not even be aware.

Matt Smith: 00:10:18

With Integrity is already not living? Well. I wasn't living with like full out integrity, it's not even integrity. It was the cost. It's a really good question. Like energy, I get a lot of a lot of energy, because you're not trying to be something you're not. And then it costs connection as well. One of my biggest values is connection. Now, yeah, but it can't not connection, because because no one's perfect. Everyone's got struggles. But if I'm out there going, Hey, my life is perfect. Look at me. Although people might aspire to that there's no connection. There's no genuine connection.

Philippe Bartu: 00:10:53

Actually, it creates disconnection. Yeah. And what you want to what you want to create through that is connection. And it's just so it's actually it's a counterproductive way on fulfilling on what you want. Yeah, I completely agree. You know, and, and it's so interesting now, without examining these hidden agendas, these things just happen. And they go unnoticed. Yeah. So what what is it? What is it that shifted for you when you got to see that, as in? What are some of the realizations and the shifts that you've had? So I had a call

Matt Smith: 00:11:31

with a gentleman, not so long ago. And he gave me this analogy of when I'm going to anybody, because especially my girl, I was going through something a few weeks ago, and and I was like, Why can't just Just love me, when I'm going through this stuff, right? Give me Give me like, I need love in this moment. Because because I was aware of childhood trauma and stuff. And what I needed is love. And he was like, you know, when you go to somebody needing love, you're almost like a beggar in the street. And there's no judgement when he was saying this about, he was like, you're going to them like you're a beggar in the street. And he was like, how does that make you feel in your body, when you feel like you're going to your girlfriend, like a beggar industry going I need love from you. And I was like, it doesn't feel very empowering, feels restricted, it feels all of this stuff like heavy and horrible. And whatever he was, like, long story short, he was like, You need to realize that you, you already have all the love. You are it like there's an abundant source of where it comes from. And you can just give that to yourself that was a realization is that I can give it to myself in that moment that I that I thought I needed it from out there, I could just give it to myself. And that shifted everything in the relationship. Like since that happened, me and Jess had just gone from strength to strength with it, because now I'm not showing up from a needy place whenever either she triggers me or I'm going through something, I can just be with myself, give myself what I need. And then I'm showing up from love As love in that moment. And then

Philippe Bartu: 00:13:04

I'm listening to what you're saying with a lot of a lot of care in the language that you're using around this. And I find it fascinating how you've described this and I can really recognize the shift of the beauty and recognizing that the love that you seek is within you. There's something that you said that I'm that doesn't look. me just let me just say it when you say give it to myself. Yeah, what does it what does that mean? So

Matt Smith: 00:13:36

let's use an example. Let's go back a few weeks because I've been so into it at the moment. Yeah, remember an example that?

Philippe Bartu: 00:13:44

Well, maybe I can I can share something that looks how that looks to me. So so give it to myself. When I listened to that what I heard was, it was love, right? sort of give me the love that I see give it to myself. And I can see that and what occurs to me is rather than give it to myself, is recognize that it is what I am. I cannot give myself what I already am. Yeah.

Matt Smith: 00:14:17

You know, I heard that as an analogy somewhere where someone said if you're a cow, if you're a cow, you can't give yourself a cow like you are

Philippe Bartu: 00:14:24

Yeah, so so it feels to me like there's there's a recognizing or waking out to the truth, that who you are and your essence is love and being and that being a place to come from. And I yeah, I want to say that this is this is really a oh, this is really something that has completely shifted my being in in how I can yeah in the way that I that I've started to live my life but also this this idea of accomplishment and one As the, you know, when we often when we talk about all these great things that we want to do in the world, and I noticed that sometimes I can get overwhelmed, you know, thinking of everything, everything that I want to create, right. And, and I noticed that there's been a distinction that that I have become more present to, and it is seeing the difference between I want to create this and when I have it, then I'll be accomplished. To I am accomplished. Now, what do I want to create from a place of I am accomplished already? Where do I want my I am accomplished nest to flow into. And I feel like that is I am not looking to fill a void through accomplishments. I am looking to overflow from a place of accomplishment. And that for me has been both serving, expansive loving, giving, sharing. And and I feel like that's actually how I feel. This whole conversation has been created from Yeah,

Matt Smith: 00:16:15

when Yeah, you've you fill your own cup. And now it's like, yeah, now what do I want to do from this place? Where do I want to pour? This? Yeah, accomplishment or love? Or beingness? Where do I want to pour it into and it's a choice of what you just desire to create one to create rather than one you need to so you can get something from it. Right. And that was the that was a good thing about like, the ultimate experiences because I was when I did the meditation, I was just in the space of I turned my hand to my life over to God, I call it God, not that anything's outside of us. But it's like what's inside me that wants to come out. And then got the vision and, and Ramadan. And it's not like it was it was me and my vision because I spoke to a lot of people right after I ran with it. And they were like, oh my god, I had that idea. Come to me, but I never ran with it. So I don't believe it was we're all one anyway. Right? If we were all one and it will pardon? Expansion of university things. And so I was in audio. I don't need anything like us.

Philippe Bartu: 00:17:14

Yeah. Beautiful. So look at who you being to run with it. Service. Yeah, that was that was.

Matt Smith: 00:17:23

That's the word. Yeah. So

Philippe Bartu: 00:17:25

you were being service?

Matt Smith: 00:17:28

Yeah. Yeah. Service to the core service to the service to the people that would be there. Almost service to like, whoever was going to be speaking as well. Just just so serve the team in any way. I remember the team calls as like, right, what do we need? What do you need from me and, and things like that. And it was just from this place of service. But then as we go through life, I don't know if you've heard the phrase new levels, new devils.

Philippe Bartu: 00:17:54

But that's a good one.

Matt Smith: 00:17:57

Because again, like I told you in a previous conversation, I've never actually sent an event through to completion I was the failed event runner, like never had any events. So one ticket lower 500. And so that was a new level for me this running this event having a team and new levels came up for me like who am I to run this and, and things like that. And when you go into those new levels, you can either face the devils that come up or you can run away from them and like I've shared before I nearly ran away impostor syndrome was was massive for me. And so I nearly ran away from it. But fortunately, I had brilliant people around me like just encouraged me and and the team like rag and Kirsch were were phenomenal. They call me base and so did Steve to be fair. Yeah. Like created me as as the version of me that I needed to be in order to see this thing through and, and so but it ultimately comes down to a choice like, you're going to chose to walk away and listen to impossible

Philippe Bartu: 00:18:50

it's also an interesting word to call it the devil. Because what is that devil thing? Because it does sound pretty nasty.

Matt Smith: 00:19:03

I would say it's the stories. Yeah, everything that is an illusion. So everything everything that we're not so it's not like some some beast in hell waiting for you but it's almost like everything everything that we're not I again I believe that we are essentially just the light so the devil is anything that suppose that I'm not good enough I'm not worthy. I'm not deserving anything. That's not true.

Philippe Bartu: 00:19:30

Right? So what I'm hearing in this is you became present to what's going on inside of you. You became present to the stories that were going on and in becoming present to that you were able to what the bigger than it right?

Matt Smith: 00:19:48

So when you when I face it, it because I think that's what a lot of people are they're scared to actually face the fear or the fear. They believe that they're bigger than like the feelings or so what

Philippe Bartu: 00:19:58

what what was the you have to face So that was the big scary it.

Matt Smith: 00:20:03

The feeling of abandonment, the feeling of rejection, the feeling of not worthy not deserving not good enough.

Philippe Bartu: 00:20:16

So yeah, all these self judgments are coming up for you. Yeah. Yeah. And then you started believing that's the that's what you are. Yeah. And and you started identifying with them? Yes. And then at some point what happened? What what what what? Yeah like how did that what shifted for you?

Matt Smith: 00:20:36

Again this is just a personal belief of mine that I believe that we're always supported in our in our greatness and again God whatever you want to call it wants us to realize our potential our truth and we live in a supportive universe that's always helping us. And so because I have that belief, it almost opens the door for people to come in and say hang on a minute, that's imposter syndrome. Hang on a minute, you are the leader, you need to be hang on a minute, you are good enough, hang on a minute you are loved. And it's just whether we're open to receiving that, or believing the story in the lie. And so that's that's what shifted is allowing and not wanting the smallness as well is not wanting that not being committed to the smallest. He's like, No, I don't want it. I want the fear. I don't want the hold it. Yeah, ultimately, it comes down to fear, doesn't it? Whether we we fear abandonment, or we fear judgment, or we fear rejection, it's still under the umbrella of fear.

Philippe Bartu: 00:21:35

Yeah. And was there a time you just want to run away from it all? Yes. And I think there was a time you even did just gave yourself the space and went up to the mountains and or in the Midlands and had a Yeah, had a bit of some retreat from? Yeah, yeah. Yeah. And then

Matt Smith: 00:21:55

I'll happily do that as well. Like, if I do well, I'll give myself permission to do that. But not run away and hide, but just take myself away for and give myself what I you know, when we give it to ourselves, is like, what do I what do I need in this moment? Right now? Do I need space for your food? Do I need sleep? Do I need? What do I need right now?

Philippe Bartu: 00:22:12

Yeah, so yeah. And coming back to what you're saying about, you know, I need you to give me love. I mean, just that as a sentence, right? There's so much that we can learn from that. And from that place of being in relationships. And you know, when I hear you say that, what comes up for me is one of my hidden agendas that I've had for many years was the idea of giving and receiving was my hidden agenda. My hidden agenda was I would give to receive, and there was always like, a, an expectation when I was giving. And it's really something that sort of just taken on as something normal, something that I've learned from family and that I had to unlearn. And it is really noble, for me to think that you know, and I'm giving without expectations, and I'll create all these beautiful stories of, but I'm but I was really blind to a lot of that. And it was costing me a lot of connection. And inauthenticity. Yeah. And I would connect with people thinking what can I get? I would be in relationships, thinking. My hidden agenda is, what's the benefit for me? Yeah. And it's yeah, it's, you know, it takes a lot of self honesty to see that and to, you know, be willing to just accept that or even own up to that. And, and, and I feel like from a place of just love, a place of unconditional love, like there is there is no giving and no receiving. There just is. Yeah, and every act of care is an exchange of I don't even know if that if exchange is the right word, I think it's more of an expression of love

Matt Smith: 00:24:19

it it's almost like being in alignment with the universe as well. We're going to use this this analogy with clients. It's like the flower the flower doesn't blossom to give something to the bee so that the bee can take it and then pollinate it and spread it around so the flower then gets to continue its life. It's the flower just blossoms because that's its purpose in that moment. Yeah. And when we connect to our what's our purpose in this moment, then then the bee comes and takes pollen when it all works out. Right? And that's what I found like with that was the dance with the ultimate experience that it started off with me going right what's my purpose in this moment, and it's like, right, share the post in the group. And then it's onto the Next moment, okay, what's my purpose now? Right? I'm going to answer the call to Steve because Steve's in the post and he wants to talk to me. And I never spoke to him before. And then Eric's on the phone to me saying, hey, about like posting in Facebook groups. And it's like, right, what's my purpose? And when I, whenever I stay totally present it things just carried on and carried on, it just kept getting better and better. But when I was in this story in my head of, Oh, am I going to get this? And I'm not going to get that. That's when the, I would say suffering start against suffering is a loaded word. Right. But that's when the suffering started.

Philippe Bartu: 00:25:31

Yeah, I can so relate to that. Thank you for sharing that. And

Matt Smith: 00:25:36

just finished up in the same with the relationship as well. Isn't when everyone just being present in the moment or Jess, and just being in the moment and really tapping into the nature of me and, and the core of who I am. It's got right, what does this moment require right now, and it might just be nothing, just sit and just be and just let her do her thing. And, okay, cool. And then there's no suffering, and then it flows into the next moment, the next moment. And whenever there's again, suffering in the relationship, it's usually from a place of I'm telling the story that I need to get something from her, or I need to warm in a certain way, in order to make sure she sticks around so I don't get abandoned. And 20 years is when you try and perform so that she sticks around, that's when she pulls away. And

Philippe Bartu: 00:26:17

yeah, totally. You're actually trying to force an outcome. Yes, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Totally. And, and so yeah, it's, I mean, right now, one of the, one of the challenges that I have been dealing with, and my relationship has been just a, my wife who's, gosh, she's 39 weeks pregnant. So we're about to, she's about to go into labor anytime. And it just happens that, due to a lot of a lot of background stories, she's actually not really in any relationship with my parents. And that was really, that was like a really, really hard one for me to lovingly accept, and I had done so much to try and open new ways of communicating and creating the possibility of us to, you know, be together and be harmonious and, and it was almost like, I had this healing story, that life will be better when my family gets along, and harmony. Oh, that was my hidden agenda, is I am the Savior. And because I'm the coach, here I am, I'm going to come in, and I'm going to create the insights and the conditions for everyone to kinda have their have the breakthroughs they need. And we're all going to be happily together again. And my hidden agenda there was, I was actually being selfish. Because I wasn't comfortable in the face of no agreement. And when I say in the face of no agreement, what I really mean is, there's a massive disagreement between my wife and my parents and are able to split it seemingly can't agree on many things on this conflict. So my identity is I'm the peacemaker. I want to create harmony. And that was my hidden agenda. And but my hidden agenda is I actually I am uncomfortable with conflict. And what do I actually want to do? I'm looking to change the situation. And the noble, self justifying excuse I tell myself is, I am the peace Bringer. I bring harmony, it's like, well, hang on a sec, I'm not in harmony and myself, how am I going to bring harmony if I myself and not in harmony within this conflict. And, you know, I'm currently on our on a seminar in with a with a landmark program called excellence. And it was really insightful, because I got to see that there's a lot of the work that also that Steve has done. And the foundation of the landmark Forum, which the book also talks about, is getting complete with the past, getting complete with relationships where you're incomplete. And so, again, my story was, I'm gonna get complete. But what I didn't understand is for me to be complete, I thought I had to force an outcome for harmony. And what occurred to me in the seminar is actually the only way I can be complete is to be complete with the fact that this is incomplete. Yeah, nice. And that completion was not conditioned to the situation. And when that shifted our mat, there was like, a whole load just fell off of me and I fired myself from the role of Peacemaker. Nice. That's not my job, wow. And I noticed that the thing that dropped away was the resistance to what's going on, there was no resistance. And so I was able to enjoy time. And I still am able to enjoy time with my wife, with my mom with my dad. And I'm no longer having conversations trying to change things. I'm no longer trying to enroll them into a new possibility of us being harmoniously together, I get to just be present to what's here, not trying to force an outcome or create a future that I think will be better. And coming back to what you said, and the very essence of what you said around being loved and accepted.

Philippe Bartu: 00:31:04

Ultimately, I wanted my wife to be loved and accepted by my parents. Because I want to be loved and accepted by my parents. Well, yeah. And the freedom of letting go of that need for my parents to love and accept my wife. Just like, I can just laugh about and now and whenever, you know, whenever there are comments, I always had to defend her, I always had to. And I can just honor that. That's what's true for them. And that's how they create my wife. And that's how they see my wife. And I still fall into the trap of defending, I'm still not immune to that. I'm working on it. It's a work in progress. But I'll tell you what, it's it's shifted. It's shifted everything. And now I can just look forward to being a dad. And I can just look forward to being present to, to how things are, and to be grateful for what is and not suffering from what I think should be.

Matt Smith: 00:32:18

Yes, that word should isn't it?

Philippe Bartu: 00:32:21

The word should yeah, it the word should is a great way to look at within yourself, where you're not taking full ownership of your life. Because should is such such a victim word. And it's such a disempowering word. And I agree, and it doesn't create anything. What are you what are you hearing investment?

Matt Smith: 00:32:47

I'm hearing that should should be banished from?

Philippe Bartu: 00:32:54

Well, well, I actually actually think it's not about making shirred wrong. But when we use should, it's an invitation to be present to what's really going on inside of you. And to look at where there's resistance. And to look at where you're not taking full responsibility for your life. So actually should is an invitation to look.

Matt Smith: 00:33:19

Yeah. Because you're probably projecting out.

Philippe Bartu: 00:33:23

Yeah. And so I actually think, gosh, if we if we would ban it, there would be no opportunity to get a real breakthrough. As soon just means there's a hidden agenda. That's actually a I don't know what the word is, I'd say is a kind of like a red flag or a smoke alarm as Ocula. Yeah, I like that. It's a smoke alarm. Yeah, should is a smoke alarm. And it's a way of access to uncovering your hidden agenda.

Matt Smith: 00:33:57

Completely agree. Totally agree. I remember I did a post about that actually, with bought just the Byron Katie book, because I know it would I know it would help him. We're both open to exploring and things. loving, loving yours. Yeah, thanks. Because that was a game changer for me many years ago. And I still do the work as much as I can on it. And I was like, chest, you should read that you should read the book, you should read the book, you should read the book you should read. And I told her for about three weeks that she should read the book. And then I got up in the middle of night to go to the bathroom. And the book was literally staring me in the face. I'm like, Okay, I don't need any more nudges universe, I'll grab the book. And I read, I think like half the page and had one of the biggest insights breakthroughs that I've had for a very long time. So this whole projection of you should read this was actually I should read this or there's something there for me. And it was just an incredible, profound insight that I had. So like you said, that should work. They should. They should do that or they should be this or they should be that like you said, I think it's great. Yeah, it's an invitation to look at hang Got a minute? What's going on

Philippe Bartu: 00:35:01

for me? Yeah. And you know, as a coach, it's also a great way to listen to language, you know, and seeing how that gets in the way of intimacy. You know, let's just give you an example as I was actually, this was I was having a conversation with a friend, who she was, she went on holiday in Italy with a break from the three kids, and she was with her husband. And she was telling me how she wasn't really she didn't really enjoy the holiday. And it was a real disappointment. And, and she was giving me all the reasons why. But something felt off. And so I started getting curious about, well, what is her hidden agenda for her not to enjoy her holiday. And, as I, as I got present with that, I asked her with her permission, if I could, you know, say that, you know, something that I think would be uncomfortable, and that she doesn't want to hear, but if it's okay, she gave me permission. And I said to her, it looks to me like your hidden agenda is envy. Oh, and she really heard that. And she said to me, Oh, my God, that's so true. And what had happened is, they recently had a big move from a sick from Sydney, to Singapore. And she had to do all the move by herself. And she didn't get any help. And she just felt unsupported and abandoned, and how to do that by herself, or her husband was working in Singapore. And so this trip was a way for him, who felt because their relationship was very much based on giving and receiving. So there was an emotional debt that he had accumulated towards her. And so for him to reset, if you look at, if you look at things through giving and receiving, if she gets a holiday, and they have a great time together, then it resets the emotional debt. The problem was, she felt that it wasn't fair, because she had done all the work, and now he's getting a holiday. And so for her to reset the emotional debt, she didn't want to be happy, because if she was happy, he would be happy. And if she was miserable, well, it's gonna affect him. And that was just a way of her getting revenge, to reset the balance, so that the emotional Dead was neutral. Oh. And she sabotaged without, you know, without even. Yeah, whether without examining these hidden agendas, her whole holiday was kind of sanitized. And so it's, it's really, it's really important to, to start asking yourself and start examining what these hidden agendas are, and who are we being, you know, in that she was being? You owe me. And, and this is, again, like one of the, one of the big hidden agendas I see in relationship is the idea of giving and receiving. Yeah, and then wanting to do things to get something in return. And another example is he flew her business class, so that she could spend time with his mother and the kids. And it felt like that, and that gave him leverage, right. So everything was it was it was so interesting to cast her to, to observe the Yeah, and he had a story of but I'm so generous. And in that generosity, lies, selfishness, unexamined selfishness,

Matt Smith: 00:38:52

yes. When you start looking at things they become so clear, especially Pathlight patterns are really good things to look out know when you can see it, then it's like, Alright, what's my pattern, like you said, with relationships, usually, people have a pattern, we attract a similar kind of partner, even though the form will change the person will change, they tend to have like similar traits or we have apart I mean, my pattern in in all of life was life would get real good. And then I'll do something to sabotage it and it'll go bad. And then I'd build it back up again. And one of my coaches called it the Phoenix syndrome, which is like fly from the ashes and then burn it down to the ground and have to rebuild from the ashes again. And then I looked at that it was it was the last time in jest had a bit of a thing. And I was like, what is it like it got really good. And I remember we were lying in bed one morning, and I remember saying, so I was like, I'm happier than I've ever been like, it's beautiful. No big bear that dogs are on it. And it was a it's a cottage in the countryside. And it was just like, it's like, right I'm this is the best I've ever had. It's brilliant. And then it was almost like the Next day were things like blew up. And we had a Fallout, big Fallout and Fallout, right? What has been one of the exercises I do is go and go, right? What does this remind me of? What does this remind me of this feeling. And what it was is, again, parents hurting me when when I was kid not physically hurts me, but like the whole abandonment thing. And, and, and I realized that my all my parents now want is they love me, and they just want me to be happy. But because I had this in hidden agenda to get them back for causing me pain when I was younger, whenever I got happy, and my parents got are really proud of you really happy for you. I'm like, you don't get to be happy for me, because you did this to me when I was like two or so now I'll go and sabotage it be miserable, which made them miserable. So that was my hidden agenda. That's revenge right there. And then it wasn't until I cleared that and was like, hang on a minute, I've got to offer them forgiveness, because they were just doing the best of what they could at the time and what they had at the time. So I had to clear that off for them forgiveness and send them love and then remind myself that we don't need to cut our nose off to spite our face. And we could just live in the good. And it doesn't matter if people are happy for us, or jealous of us or any of that. Yeah. And like I said, since then, things just keep getting better and better for us. And that's not like a braggadocious comment, which is what it used to be before like, look at me and how good my life is. Now give me love. It's just once you heal the thing, oh, yeah, it doesn't show up, then the pattern isn't as bad. And once you heal the thing underneath the pattern, don't need to have the thing to bring your awareness to

Philippe Bartu: 00:41:32

here. Yeah, so good. So good. And there's another hidden agenda that I'm picking up in what you're sharing, which is something I hear a lot of parents say I just want my child to be happy. Yeah, I just want you to be happy. That in itself, what if you examine that? What does that mean? Like, that's actually, to me, what I'm hearing is, I want you to be happy based on my metrics of happiness. Yes, not yours. So it's actually a lie. I don't want you to be happy. It's, I want you to be controlled by what happiness means to me and for you to live by my standard of happiness, not yours. Yeah, that's an unreal, often not always, but often sort of an underlying observation that I've that I've noticed behind that, because ultimately, what, what I think is, as a parent, it's like, I just want you to be free. I just want you to be free. And to I think happiness is it's rather like as a Yeah, well, what would really be beautiful as I just want you to be free to be yourself to be self expressed, and to live your life on your terms. Like, what a difference that I want you to be happy. Yeah. And I and I will, and I will love you, support you and respect you. In no matter way in no matter how that looks for you. Hmm. And that's for any for any relationship.

Matt Smith: 00:43:17

But but it comes from the we have to we don't have to what's that? Yeah, it can only come you can only say that with conviction. If you're being that for yourself,

Philippe Bartu: 00:43:28

right? That's why it's like if I feel that I am successful, I am successful based on whatever success means to me. But if I feel that my success is dependent on the approval of my parents, which for a long time has been, I will look and create a career that validates me being successful through their eyes. Oh. So even now, there have been times where I have played with the idea of going back to the hotel industry and becoming a general manager. And if I examine that, the real reason behind that is so I can be finally loved and accepted by my parents, so I can finally be successful in their eyes. And that, as an unexamined belief can be a lifelong thing. I've known people that have gone studied something in university, because their hidden agenda was I want to be loved and accepted by my parents. So it's kind of a big deal to what we what we're exploring here today. And when it is uncovered the freedom that lies on the other side of it.

Matt Smith: 00:44:51

And that's ultimately I believe, what what we really desire is to just ultimately be free to be yeah Yeah, selves, right?

Philippe Bartu: 00:45:00

Yeah, yeah, freedom. And actually, what I felt the Ultimate Book, the ultimate coach book really points to, is a way of living life, where you're free to be free to express yourself, free to do from a place of being free. And it's really a book of freedom, more than anything, and a way to access more of that freedom within each and every one of us. That's that's a really good way to summarize that book.

Matt Smith: 00:45:35

Really good way to summarize that book. And, uh, yeah, I think the suffering comes from any any suffering comes from this belief of story that what we want or need is outside of us. And we have to perform in a certain way that isn't us in order to get it. And that's, that's just hard work. It's tiring. It's confusing. It's. But when, like you say, you come home to this, knowing that you're good as you are, and you will be supported and you're safe, and all of your needs will be met. I think that's the only thing is that when you realize that all of your needs currently are met, and they will be met. If you'd be free to be you, then it's past the when the fun begins.

Philippe Bartu: 00:46:23

Yeah, yeah. Beautiful. And the two things I'm hearing that one is distinguishing those hidden beliefs and taking responsibility for them. Yes. And by saying, by taking responsibility, what I'm saying is letting go of your attachment to it aren't even giving up. The hate the hidden agenda, recognizing it, giving it up. And that's a lifetime practice. And that's something that I'm yeah, this conversation is reminding me of, and yeah, keeping the ball on keeping my eye on the, on the hidden agendas, because they're not easy to see. So thank you, thank you, Matt, for this beautiful reminder for sharing yourself so openly. Truthfully, vulnerably. I feel this is a beautiful place to bring this conversation to completion is Is there something you want to share before we before we complete our conversation today?

Matt Smith: 00:47:39

The only thing I would say just from my personal experience is is that nothing is bigger than us. No fear, no story, no situation or circumstances bigger than us. And one of Steve's declarations in his, in his in his document is that I don't sweat the small stuff. And it's all small stuff, including death and dying. And when we can fully, fully accept and own that from a place of realizing that we are Ultimate Life or whatever definition we use, right? Light energy, consciousness awareness, when we realize it is small stuff, and we don't have to sweat it. That's again, that's where the fun is. That's where the freedom is. That's where the play is. And ultimately, that's what we're here to do, I believe is just to have fun and play. Yeah, have what we want and the experience one, but from a place of wholeness and completeness. And we're here to give while also hang on checking out what's my hidden agenda here. This is a new level, there might be a new devil that I'm facing, and but just know that whatever however big the boss is, at the end of the level, or the devil, whatever you want to call it, you're still bigger than it and there's a way to move through it and overcome it. So good.

Philippe Bartu: 00:48:51

I love that. Map. Thank you for those for those words. I also want to say thank you for all of you who have been listening to our conversation today. I'd love to hear from you. What do you think of this new format? What do you think of having today that this episode really kind of with a focus around hidden agendas and having more of a topic? I'd love to hear from you. And if you want to be in touch with Matt, Matt, what would be the best way for people to connect with you and get in touch with you if they feel drawn to do that?

Matt Smith: 00:49:28

To two or three ways The first Waze is paying me an email which is the coach Matt smith@gmail.com. The coach Matt smith@gmail.com. Matt with Two T's I'm on Facebook as my facebook.com forward slash Matt Smith 2310. And Instagram has Coach Matt Smith as well but if they want to get in touch them I'm more than open to having any conversation about

Philippe Bartu: 00:49:57

self. Yeah, beautiful. Well Matt, thank you for, for sharing yourselves with us today I feel enriched and nourished from from this conversation and thank you for sharing and being here with us today.

Matt Smith: 00:50:13

It's my absolute pleasure thank you very much for being with me and doing this dance live. always love it when we get together and we just riff on stuff. And I always I mean, I've taken so much from from this myself. So thank you for showing up and being you. Appreciate you.